Dr James, 2s:

Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Dentists Who Invest Podcast and continuing the theme of refocusing the Dentists Who Invest Podcast on anything and everything finance, specifically for the dental profession. I've got back Mr Anick Sharma, who was on the podcast not terribly long ago. I think this is our third episode now, which is really cool, isn't it Anick? Now, which is really cool, isn't it a? And uh, yeah, so it's what we're going to cover today continuing the theme of finance whenever it comes to dentists. We're going to be covering your investment journey and the need, the need to knows whenever it comes to everything along those lines. So let's pick up really where we left off, annick, because this podcast is a continuation podcast. We're going to build on the knowledge given in the previous podcasts and talk and refer to some of the ideas and concepts we brought up on there. If you haven't seen those episodes, best thing to do is to watch them. They're both about retirement planning and, if you have, if you don't get the time to watch them just before we shoot today, well, guess what? We're just going to do a little bit of a recap of some of the more high-level concepts. So what it will mean is that this episode in and of itself. Well, you can enjoy it discreetly and without necessarily having to listen to those other episodes. So anyway, annick, how are you? How's it going? How have you been since your last book?

Anick, 1m 16s:

yeah, really good, thanks, busy as ever, and life's good. What about you?

Dr James, 1m 20s:

yeah, man just uh busy hustling, so to speak I don't know if you can call it that. Uh, that might give the impression that it's glamorous very much, just getting stuff done, the nitty-gritty building and what have you, uh. But yeah, anyway, on the, on the, on the theme of this podcast, I know we're here today to talk about our investment journey, and you know what somebody wants to describe their investment journey to me as something along the lines of that every journey has three, three parts to it. You've got the start, you've got the finish and then you've got the part in between, which is the vehicle, or the methodology, or the journey, so to speak. And investing is exactly akin to that, for reasons that we're going to go into right now, aren't we? We, Anick, yeah, exactly that.

Anick, 2m 5s:

So past couple of webinars we've spoken about at a high level financial planning and getting from point A to point B, having a financial plan in place and executing on those mechanisms. Today let's focus on the actual implementation, ie how we get from A to B. Typically it's through some sort of investment-related journey and some of the intricacies and nuances to consider. So the big question is why bother investing? A couple of reasons the time value of money is a really important concept. The same amount of money today is worth more than the same amount in 10 years' time. A couple of reasons for that Returns You'd expect if you invested that money in a certain way, you'd expect a return. So that present value has the potential to grow, which, within the context of a financial plan, we can allocate funds into relevant investments and allow it to grow. The other thing and I get this quite a lot inflation. Why not just keep a whole lot of cash in the bank account rather than investing? So inflation's been everywhere at the moment and let's say your bank account's paying 5% interest at 10% In real terms, are you nested with inflation? It means your money's actually on five percent backwards. So it's really important when we think about financial planning. We want the current purchasing power to retain its value, with inflation at least moving forward and that's the whole thesis and principle of investing right.

Dr James, 3m 43s:

that's what we want to do. That's the aim of the game of investing right. That's what we want to do. That's the aim of the game. Yeah, not just retain its value, but also appreciate and grow in value relative to inflation, because investing is all about how can we reproducibly get the biggest margin possible in terms of returns for money. But obviously not just as simple as that. There's a few other considerations in there, but that, at a very basic level level, is the goal and the objective.

Anick, 4m 8s:

Exactly when we think about how we invest. There's a few key principles. Capitalism is the free market mechanism of wealth creation. Essentially, same principles happen from dusty markets in Southeast Asia to the biggest corporations in the world. So markets are incredibly efficient. The stock market is so efficient. Information is constantly priced in and particularly recently, with talk of a recession, I've had clients ask me what's going to happen to the stock market and how is it going to impact it. Answer is and I don't know, and no one else knows what's going to happen in the future. But because markets are so incredibly efficient, they price in all the information. So by the time you hear about a potential recession in the news, the reality is it's already priced in. So whenever a recession does happen, we don't generally tend to see too much movement. For example, 2008, 2009, the global financial crash Economies went absolutely under. The stock market returns over those couple of years, as it rebounds, were massive. There's definitely a big distinction between economies and markets. There's definitely a big distinction between economies and markets. So it brings nicely onto the point you can't consistently predict stock market returns. There's a really good bit of data. It looks at the S&P returns from if you invested $1,000 in 1990 until today, that $1,000 would have turned into $22,000 in S&P, which is great. Now, over the course of that length of time, if you miss just the best five, 25 days of investing, that potential $22,000 reduces to $5,000. So it's a massive, massive difference. And the issue is, if you predict it right once, you then need to predict it right going back into the stock market and it's just so difficult to do, which, when we consider the type of assets we use and what we should actually put our money into, the concept of risk and return is really important. So when we think of risk, typically we think of volatility, ie how much should the price move? And I'll come on to some different thoughts of risk in a moment. But not all risks are worth taking and there's a person called Harry Markowitz in the financial profession. He's a pioneering figure who looks at modern portfolio theory and there's a load of evidence to say that not all risks are worth taking. So we have a thing called unsystematic risk. That basically means non-market risk, so company specific or stock or sector risk, and by putting all eggs into one basket it's not a risk worth taking because it can be diversified against, which brings us nicely onto the next topic of diversification. People often say it's the closest thing to a free lunch you can get in investing because by having a good mix of companies or countries or sectors it means if one goes under, you're balanced out. All those eggs aren't in one basket and there's no real rational reason to massively overweight to a specific country. There's some really good charts out there that show annual returns going from left and right and different countries ranking. So Sweden, for example, might be top of the tree in one year and when you follow that route through, it's interesting to see how it ranks for the subsequent years and you can't make a pattern on it. So trying to make an active bet on which way to go is just going to lead to wealth destruction. So it is a rational to take on more risk than we need to, which is really helpful within a cash flow context, with what we've looked at the webinars recently, when we build a cash flow building. Looking at point point a to point b, we can see the risk required to achieve a lifetime desire of whatever it might be. And quite often people will come to me and say I'm at 10, yeah, 12 a year and I think we're really well conditioned to be in a mindset of chasing returns. But I'd encourage you to take a step back and say why? What are you chasing your return for? What is it you need that return for? Because if in your mind you need 10% a year but we can show the cash flow, you can achieve your dream life, you can retire early, you can spend life traveling with the kids, with the family, for four percent a year, five percent a year, what's the point in chasing those returns?

Dr James, 9m 15s:

well, it's the peace of mind as well, isn't it? You know? I mean I people are so obsessed with, uh, how can we say eking out the most returns they can get in their portfolio, like beating the market per se? But I'm like okay, let's say you are successful, and successful is an extra one, two, three percent every single year. How much bandwidth did that cost you, though? The amount of sleep that you use, think you lose sleeping or the amount of sleep that you use. Think you lose sleeping. The amount of sleep that you lose when you're thinking is what I'm trying to say about a portfolio that is diverged from, let's just say, maybe being invested in a fund that is representative of the world stock market. Because to beat the market, you have to constantly analyze things, keep on top of things, and you only beat the market in a certain snapshot. Right. Right, so you can be ahead one day and not ahead another day, right, but in order to maintain that, you gotta understand what you're doing and you've got to think about it. You've got to actually actively pay attention to it. So for me, it's just like, unless you're one of these people who's just making millions from picking stocks and what have you, which a lot of us aren't at that level, then feasibly a really solid strategy that will probably beat like 95, 98% of people out. There is a decent, well-diversified index fund.

Anick, 10m 38s:

Yeah, and I'll take that one step further. So we call that active investing, ie making active bets on what's going to happen. And there's two ways we can go about it. Or active investing can do it Stock specific ie they're going to bet a certain individual stock Apple, tesla, whatever it might be is going to crash or it's going to go to the moon. So they either under or overweight their position. So they either under or overweight their position. The other is to market time. So an active investment manager might turn around and say I think the stock market is going to crash tomorrow and have a massive movement to cash. Or they might say I think next week the stock market is going to pick up and move their allocation accordingly. I've looked at a lot of evidence and data on this pick up and move their allocation accordingly. I've looked at a lot of evidence and data on this and it is nigh on impossible to consistently get those timings right, because you need I just mentioned it before but you need to get it right on the way in and then on the way out every single time. So if you're investing regular contributions or having an ongoing investment journey to get that over a course of 40 or 50 years. It's impossible. The other thing as well people try and look for price arbitrages. The difficulty is that Joe Bloggs, the average investor, is then competing against the massive behemoths of the investment managers. You have huge teams of analysts trying to look for these pricing differences. Now, if I'm saying all the data out there suggests they can't do it consistently, joke bloggers are going to have a really difficult time to do so and it's just going to lead to wealth destruction and not good outcomes. On top of that, the average investor for an active investment fund has really high costs to have to overcome. I think the cherry on the cake for me is, if you look at the data and if you look at the percentage of active funds that are still around after 10 or 20 years, it's so low. That's just testament to it's impossible to get it right consistently over a long period of time. Don't get me wrong. There will be some active investment managers out there who do a fantastic job and consistently beat the market. There's a secondary question we should be asking is that luck or skill? And it's incredibly hard to get to the bottom of it, but by the time we can get to the bottom of it. So long of a time has passed that active investment manager. They've retired and they're living up in the Bahamas and passed on their active funds to someone else, which is not great for our retirement.

Dr James, 13m 15s:

My tenet says if you do want to actually increase your income, is just to boost your income. It's as simple as that. And think about how you can upskill as a dentist or get better at communicating the value that you give, because I promise you how many people out there would kill for like five, six, seven grand of passive income every single year. So let's say somebody works 40 hours a week and they receive 100,000 pounds of income every single year and that's total, lots of dentistry on that pay packet, right? So you can have. You can work 40 hours a week and have 100 grand of income a year. Or you can work 40 hours a week and have 110 grand of income a year, 10 of which 10,000 of which is from passive sources and 100,000 is from your job. So in other words, you're still exchanging 40 hours a week for 110,000 pounds a year. Or you can just understand which is way more easy in my opinion how you can generate 110 grand a year from 40 hours a week, right, which gives you exactly the same outcome, right? And yeah, people would argue like, yeah, but the 10 grand comes in whether I do anything or not. That is true, but it just takes such a long time to get to that level of cash flow through most assets that, in my opinion, it's just so much more feasible to prioritize generating more, at least in the earlier stages, and then you can reinvest it into assets to give you cash flow as time goes on, so that that, to me, is one of the biggest hidden hacks to wealth.

Anick, 14m 45s:

Yeah, without a doubt. I think we mentioned it in one of the earlier podcasts. But the concept of a liquid bucket stuff comes into the bucket. We have assets inside the bucket and when we spend there's taps at the bottom our expenditure. Now, the stuff that's inside the bucket, your assets, cash, isas, ices, pension funds, all those sort of stuff we can sweat what's in the bucket harder. Ie we can change the risk level or the equity content to give a higher expected return. But the number one driver is how much income is coming in and if we can maximize that to your point, it's.

Dr James, 15m 18s:

It's a game changer really this is the thing, and I really feel like it would help a lot of people if they saw investing more as just optimizing returns and realistically, that's capped around a certain level and there's only so much you can optimize something you know you can. You can have a bigger, a successively bigger and bigger slice of an apple pie, right, but there's only so much pie right. There's only so much pie right. There's only so much you can have. The only other way that you can blow that out of the water is just to make the pie so much bigger that actually it negates everything else. I think optimizing comes actually secondary to increasing the size of a pie, so to speak. In the first place, and even though I guess that it sounds a little obvious when you say it out loud, I feel like a lot of people's actions maybe don't fully embrace what I've just articulated. So we're thinking about everybody. Actually, that's one of the biggest hacks to wealth right there in my opinion. But yeah, anyway, okay, cool. So we've talked a little bit about the journey, annick, and can you shed some light, with giving your expertise and background, on how that journey looks for a lot of dentists? Let's say, we've got dentists who have just qualified and they're at the start of their career. Okay, and they're thinking to themselves right, I want to get to financial freedom, not as soon as possible, not because I want to quit working, but it just I want to just have that freedom. I want to have that option. Yeah, how does that pathway look for most dentists in your experience?

Anick, 16m 51s:

You started to touch on it there in terms of we have surplus income to our requirements and allocating that to an investment can facilitate financial freedom that conjoined with a really good investment strategy. I agree the investment amount and increasing income should be the priority, but optimisation over investment is really key and that's where expertise can play a massive factor. If we don't have the investment piece right, compounding is not going to do its thing. And going back to your point, if you have an associate with 20, 30 years of investment horizon, that compounding power is so powerful. So if you don't get it right at the start, time is critical in the equation. You want to start it off in the best way possible. So typically it's a case of seeing where surplus income is and allocating that to assets that have a high expected return over a longer period of time. Now you've got to decide what assets should you put your money into and it really helps to have a framework. Look at the biggest driver returns. What's liquid, diversified has a positive impact. Low costs. It does also help to step back and think about the definition in an asset. You want something to generate future expected cash flows. That can really help to weed out some of the other things out there, such as crypto, for example.

Dr James, 18m 26s:

I was going to say I bet, I bet. I was just thinking I bet he's going to say Bitcoin. And you're right the biggest downside of Bitcoin, it's not a cash flow asset.

Anick, 18m 34s:

It's a greater thought theory. You're relying on someone else to buy off you and there's no fundamentals behind it. Now I'm not here to open up a mass accounting of worms. I don't want any listeners getting annoyed with what I've just said but from that perspective, there's no future expected cash flow. You're relying on price alone. So I think, once you have thought of those guiding principles, I love the human side of it. We've spoken a lot about financial plan and putting you at the heart of it, seeing what you love and what your drivers are. It's important to check in on ourselves, because the one of the biggest detriments to an investment outcome, success, early retirement, financial freedom can be ourselves. Investing is a bit like a roller coaster loads of ups, loads of downs, and if all of a sudden you're getting spooked by market downturn and wanting to sell, you can end up in a very, very bad position of cashing out at the wrong time. So you look to buy when the price is really really high and you sell when the price is at the bottom. So you end up in a cycle and your wealth doesn't go anywhere. It doesn't go up, you're just ruining it by having a rules-based approach. It means, if something happens, a COVID crash or whatever it might be, occurs, we're okay. Covid is an interesting one. I think the bottom of the market was about the 24th of March 2020. Now, markets were dropping so fast and so many managers out there were saying let's move to cash, essentially crystallizing some of the equity losses. Now what actually happened in reality? The rise and bounce back was so fast. No one has ever seen a bounce back that fast in recent times. Now, by not having that rules-based approach in place, you've made a loss. If we zoom out, time shows that consistency rewards long-term. Long-term investors are rewarded by consistency, sorry, and within this context, consistency beats volatility, I'd argue. Having markets go up or down by whatever percentage you want isn't really a risk. Risk is about running out of money, not having enough to fund your life, or having enough through retirement, or having all of your money eroded by inflation. Interestingly enough as well, if you look back at, I think, from about 1926 to 2022, the S&P has averaged about 10% a year. Everyone always says 10% stock market fine, but throughout that 100-year timeframe, there's only been about five or six years in which we've had an annualized return anywhere near 10%. So people quite often think, oh, I haven't achieved my 10%. A year it's been minus 10% or minus 12% or 2%. Let's pull out. But pulling out of it is just going to destroy wealth, whereas if we have these rules in place and rebalance regularly, retain the discipline of buy low, sell high, we can really facilitate that financial freedom you want.

Dr James, 21m 56s:

Can you just define that term, annualized, for the benefit of the listeners?

Anick, 22m 1s:

Yeah, so annualized just means on average per year. So if I'm saying 1926 to 2022, 10% annualized just means on average every single year between 1926 and 2022, we're hitting 10% return a year.

Dr James, 22m 17s:

So it's literally, if you just take the percentage returns over those, however many years 90 odd years, yeah and you divide it. You take the total percentage that it's increased and divide it by the number of years, that's annualized return in a very rough way.

Anick, 22m 35s:

There is compounding there as well, but for simplicity yes, so total return divided by the amount of periods or amounts of years you have, gives a annualized return, because the compounding throws it right because it actually makes a difference if you divide the total over that time.

Dr James, 22m 50s:

Versus divide, versus figure it out year by year, by year yeah, that's right because the compounding effects massive over that time so to me it would make sense. It is so. Annualized is more the second example that I did. If you actually did baller to figure it out year by year by year, that's more the annualized return. Is that right?

Anick, 23m 10s:

so the annualized return is the average return throughout the entire period of a yearly basis. So, for example, let's say we have, so 1926 to 2022, 10 per year average, but during that period we could have plus 50 minus four percent, plus three percent, minus whatever it might be. But we take an average of all those individual years. We get the annualized average.

Dr James, 23m 38s:

So it would be 50 minus 40 plus 20.

Anick, 23m 42s:

Yeah yeah, exactly right, okay, so you actually.

Dr James, 23m 45s:

You actually have to add up the percentage movement every single year and divide it. There we go boom, have I got that right?

Anick, 23m 51s:

yeah yeah, there we go.

Dr James, 23m 53s:

No, and I see what you mean that will vary based on how you measure it, but that's specifically what the term manualized means.

Anick, 23m 59s:

Okay, no, no, that's cool awesome, like key thing is if everyone says 10, you're in the stock market, but we've only had about five years out of 100 where we've been anywhere near the average, so you need to hold it for long enough, and getting spooked or doing some sort of intervention that destroys wealth isn't isn't going to help you in that regard I've read.

Dr James, 24m 22s:

I've once read and it'd be interesting to hear if you've heard this before. I'll come across this before potentially that there's a period I think it was like 1970 to 1985, that the S&P didn't even beat inflation for that period of time.

Anick, 24m 38s:

So interesting. I was actually speaking to my dad about this recently. I can't remember the exact time period. I think in the 70s or 80s. I wasn't even born then, neither were you. There's a period of hyperinflation. I think he was saying his mortgage was about 18 or 19% interest rate, which is crazy. But I really enjoyed long-term data and the assumptions. It's a relatively acute period. But whenever you zoom out and look at longer-term data over average, it's a relatively acute period. But whenever you zoom out and look at longer term data over average, say over a financial lifespan, you'd expect equities to beat inflation and as far as we know today, equities are the best hedge against inflation over long periods of time.

Dr James, 25m 28s:

Well, here's the thing, right. A lot of people who are listening to what I've just said might think to themselves well, what's the point in actually putting your money in the stock market at that stage? But the point is you don't know if and when that's going to happen. And also the point one of the other points is that you're taking the certainty or the guarantee, virtually, that your money will depreciate in value in real terms if you keep it as cash. So that's, that's the mindset flip right there. And I that was. I literally remember the day I had that epiphany where I was like, right, if I do absolutely nothing, that's actually one of the most unsafe things you can do, because you're guaranteeing you're virtually guaranteeing never reaching financial freedom, and none of these other methods are a guarantee by any means. You know there's a lot of data to suggest and a lot of evidence to show that they have helped a lot of people get there before in the past, and certainly I want to align what I do with the data.

Anick, 26m 23s:

Yeah, don't get me wrong. Cash isn't a let's kick it to the curb. Cash absolutely has its place. Cash, when we think about it, it should be the return of it rather than on it. Um, so if we have any short-term liabilities or a house extension, put a new roof on. We absolutely want cash and it's important to think about time frames. So if we need it in a couple of years, probably doesn't make sense to have those funds invested, but to ring fence it as cash, and that's what financial planning does or a cashflow model enables. We can have a look at the life trajectory and we can see what's on the horizon and pull the different levers, make tweaks accordingly and plan for the future.

Dr James, 27m 6s:

Love it, love it, absolutely love it. And you know, one of the most interesting things I find about dentists although it's probably a microcosm for generally the whole of society is the number of times that we are actually retired because we have enough money to live our best life in the here and now, now, and for it to sustain us and give us cash flow. And we don't even realize it because we're just all so conditioned to think that we have to keep working, because that's what we see around us. Yeah, and it's just. It's just. It's so powerful, right, because it just shows you that you can be so habitualized to going through the motions you don't even realize you're doing it yeah, absolutely, and see time and time again people are come I want a million pound pension, I want 10% a year.

Anick, 27m 52s:

I need all this extra income, but do you really what do you need it for? Are you sure you do? Take a step back, build out a plan, see where point B is and look at what, if anything, is needed to get from point A to point B. As you say, quite often people are already at point b but they don't realize it because we're conditioned to think we have to have x, y and z or chase a, b and c.

Dr James, 28m 17s:

It's not the case at all you don't need the lambo, so to speak. You don't. You don't need the land. You might want the lambo, but you need the lambo, and is the sacrifice worth achieving? That is it. Is it actually worth it the amount of time, the relationships, the fun things you're going to miss out on? And also, we have to remember there's literally no promise of tomorrow whatsoever.

Anick, 28m 42s:

We act like it that's a really interesting point you make. So my view is I agree with what you're saying about lambo, but for someone, their absolute dream and their dead set certain on having that Lambo and nothing else in the world means anything to them. I think it's really important we evaluate ourselves and what we want, because it's really easy to think I need Lambo because everyone else wants a Lambo. Or I have to travel when I retire or sit on the beach when I retire because that's what everyone else wants a lambo. Or I have to travel when I retire or sit on the beach when I retire because that's what everyone else wants that's the inverted commas dream.

Dr James, 29m 17s:

That's that's why retirement is portrayed. What if you don't like this, you know, but anyway exactly.

Anick, 29m 22s:

Well, what if you don't like the beach? No more, you're going to get to retirement. You're going to work really hard longer than you need to get to the beach and realize you know what I don't like this. Then we'll take some time to think about what you want, what you like, what you want out of life before embarking on this journey. And it it helps to have meaningful conversations, do a bit of self-discovery or have someone take you through that journey. Who's been through that?

Dr James, 29m 48s:

cool man and you know what. I bet there's so many more things we could talk about in addition to what we discussed today. Maybe just get more into the nitty gritty of what we can do in order to make that stuff happen. Obviously, we covered it at high level today. You know that's good and you know what I always see is this, or what I've seen before, is this you get these dentists okay, and they go through life and they invest loads in your business and then the business is thrown out, is spitting out cash, the practice, the dental practice and then what happens is they have loads of cash that's being spat out and they get to maybe like mid 50s and 60s and they're like, hmm, okay, well, do you know what? I can either keep running this business and doing it in a hands off way, yeah, or I can exit the dental practice right, or the, or just keep working, or whatever. Whatever they like, business is cool, like that. You can decide. You can just pick whatever reality you want and make the business manifest that effectively. So, anyway, what I was saying is sometimes you get the dentist you want to exit and they exit the dental practice right, and all of a sudden they've got like 3 million, yeah, in their personal name, which is really hard to flipping do unless you exit the business. Would you agree with me? And like it's pretty uncommon, the most common way is people sell a business because then you've got entrepreneur or bad business assets disposal, as it's called and then you have like this three million in your name and then they're like, hmm, I should probably get around to that investing thing somebody told me about once. That was pretty good. And then the issue is you'll go off and because you have this three million to invest all at once, you'll be charged a premium by a financial professional to invest that over and above what you would have been charged if you would have done it, did it in little segments throughout your life, plus, you've missed out on the compounding that has occurred during that time as well. So there's a lot to be said about not just waiting for that moment and then thinking about retirement. Actually, we've got to diversify and divest from our business for those reasons that we just said.

Anick, 31m 47s:

Absolutely, and it's really important, particularly at big capital events, to seek out advice beforehand, because the more you can get your ducks in a row before you pull the trigger, everything else can be so streamlined and efficient. And you're right, there are some financial professionals out there who will charge a premium. There are others who will charge a flat fee, so it looks more competitive compared to those who charge percentage-based. So that's a little nugget to look out for in the profession too.

Dr James, 32m 18s:

Sure, and we're definitely by no means saying that the financiers don't have the place. They absolutely do. It's just one thing to be wary of, to help people get the best deal and also help people think about this stuff as they progress through the journey. And there's one thing that you said that was really interesting on the podcast last time that I it makes total sense now that I think about it really, but I never really thought about it before and it's almost, it's almost. Well, it's virtually when you get to the point where you're selling a business. Business it's understanding how much you need to have the life that you want and then working backwards to get the right price for your business, your or your dental practice, so that you know that you've exited for the right number and you can sail off into the sunset. But it all starts with understanding what your number is for your ideal retirement in the first place. But most people just sell it for the highest price they possibly can. But does that mean that they're hanging on for three, four years when they didn't need to?

Anick, 33m 16s:

that's also true yeah, we see that a lot people go for high prices for no reason and earn out over five, ten years when they could be doing the things they enjoy driving around the lambo or sitting on the beach, whatever it might be. Um, but if you can exit for a lower value, which might seem a bit counterintuitive at time, but if you exit for that lower value but facilitates life you want, then why would you, why wouldn't you do it? You have all that extra time on your hands to pursue whatever it might be you want boom.

Dr James, 33m 49s:

What a lovely note to finish this podcast on today. Anick, thank you so much for your time. If anybody wants to reach out to you, how are they best off finding you?

Anick, 33m 56s:

Drop me a message in the Facebook community group or find me on LinkedIn, Anick Sharma, CFP, and I'll be happy to get back to you.

Dr James, 34m 3s:

My man Anick, once again.